Excellent. Thanks for accepting 'saints'

Oh dear.

No this is a grid that could feature on the show. Plenty of red herrings and very intellectual, probably why it stumped me. 5 out of ten tho. Top grid

*now this is a grid

I know a grid when I see one.

This is one of the best grids on the whole site, can't understand the average star rating, it's got everything you look for in a first class grid

Agreed Wrh, I fear maybe it pitched over some peoples heads and they have thusly downgraded it, shame

I think there's often an element of that Molly. In fairness a) it can sometimes go the other way too and b) While a cleverly constructed red herring is always fun, it's very difficult to get any entertainment out of a collection where you had literally zero of the required knowledge. (I confess this was the case with me and the Andrew Group: this would also be the case with anything to do with, say, Pokemon, types of radiator valve, or indeed 99% of all human knowledge.)

You could also argue that c) Crackle didn't fit quite as well into its group as, say, Golf would have done, but that's probably a personal preference for letter substitution over rhyming

But it did say rhyming!

Let's be honest, it was a poor grid when all is said and done. The rhymes were a painfully forced way of getting "ringo" in as a red herring, it actually made me laugh when I saw that connection.

This has provoked a lot of discussion, but I think it's a good, varied grid!

Gnu, I think it's a clever way of introducing ringo as a red herring and indeed creating a dummy group and also provides variety in the types of connections. It's nice to see a grid where the connections aren't all 'words followed by' or 'words preceding ......'

I fear 'words followed by' and 'words preceding ......' Are synonymous, however your point remains valid and I agree. I also like a grid where I gain a bit of knowledge